Monday, 5 July 2010

Is HD a sinister mind control cult? Discuss.

Dear Chrisg666

thank you so much for your comments on .

I have been waiting more than 7 years for someone, anyone, with your intelligence and experience to discuss Human Design at this level. I plan to contact you privately via Vox and continue there, as I feel it is best to compare notes and specifics before presenting any further discussion to the public.

Then again... here are some initial reactions to what you say.

I am trained myself in conversational hypnosis, I did the Master Practitioner in Ericksonian Hypnosis twice with Annee Linden and Stephen Goldstone of the New York Institute of NLP, as well as extensive training in NLP with John Grinder the co-founder of all such trainings, Genie Laborde, and unfortunately Tony Robbins, and others (Ross Jeffries, Mark Cunningham, people I consider top in their particular fields). It was a phase of my life for most of the 1990s.

Ra is technically in a hypnotic trance, and has often been assisted by drugs, whilst presenting his talks on Human Design. That in itself brings a hypnotic quality in his voice and talks. So it is natural to resonate and enter a trance state yourself in the presence of anyone able to hold that state themselves whilst holding a conversation or lecture.

If there are technical Ericksonian techniques, I have not found them, and I never really let up my radar on conversational hypnosis in my own life, despite my comfort in most of the trance states. I dislike the abuse of anyone by covert hypnosis. I have simply not detected any deliberate attempts at all by any of the Human Design professionals that I know.

Now, the results, that is another matter, there, I have to say there is some evidence that the RESULTS of how HD has impacted people are broadly consistent with a sinister mind control cult.

My own opinion is that is a sad consequence of personality flaws in Ra Uru Hu to a SMALL extent, and the preschool training of modern society to make people blind dumb sheep who listen to and obey parents priests poets and politicians. This is a tragedy, that most people are walking zombies as if with a slot to jam in any idiot's mind control programming. I certainly grew up in that modality and have the pain and years of attempting to throw all that off, I consider myself largely clean of it, compared to many others, and I refuse to involve myself in using such simple but dangerous methods to help others.

Some of us are trained by stupid parents and schooling to be victims of any random mind control cult - there is a HUGE demand for such slavery in this world, and I feel that HD is on an unfair playing field when we the customers turn every thing from Jesus to Madonna to Wallace and Gromit into some form of mind control cult, our needs are that desperate basically.

In conclusion, I divide Human Design into 2 parts - an increasingly fluffy tendency to dogma and unchallenged assertions validated ONLY by the master, and those items that can and indeed must be empirically tested and validated. I have to say, it remains incomplete, and perhaps dangerously incomplete, if we continue to patch the missing pieces together only with untestable dogma.

Oho Cafe, Bangkok, just arrived for a few days, 10:00am Choose day 6 July 2010

Original post from Chrisg666
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This page is rightly deleted from Wikipedia, the HD system is a commercial pyramid which whilst being a novelty to those having their initial reading by one of thousands of "analysts" has a dark side worthy of any mind control cult. Notable is that the "lectures/ awareness briefings" are given by one person only (Alan (Robert) Krakower).. by all means listen to the systematic dismantling of an individual's core beliefs in the name of enlightenment, but please read this first.

At the level at which an individual(female target group)makes changes to their relationship status at the behest of the self appointed Guru "Ra you are you who" this turns from a parlor game into a dangerous belief system for those who have become ensnared in the misappropriated language, doublespeak, and dogma.

I am qualified as a former student of this organisation.


PS: from Mahalo

Ra has refused to answer me several times WHAT IS HYPNOSIS? I presume he has no idea. He experiences many levels of cognition that need - he says - some alliance with a plant (hallucinogenic substances, or simply touching the leaves, in his theory) or animal (witch's cat etc.) but hypnosis is human to human, no plants or animals involved. Are entities involved? If so, how? Is hypnosis merely a mistaken concept - there are entities, there is control, we are not as we think, what is really going on - note his comment that almost all people (=anyone with half a tribal channel) are DESIGNED for deep (and life changing?) influence with disembodied entities types 1 through 6..

This is the key question. What is really going on with hypnosis, mind control, etc. Why is it so deeply attractive to us to BE controlled, to be absent here, to abdicate from all that matters here, and just be present "there"?

What is the shamanic world? What is the reality that people enter where we become "controlled" here, in this reality? It is URGENT to understand what we are talking about.

To simply say, ah, this is a mind control cult, avoid it, is to botch the opportunity to penetrate and resolve all this. WHY why why do we have mind control cults, why so many people NEED this, and I would say, 98% of people need this? What is going on?


  1. Having experimented with HD for 3 years, I have to say there are some very practical benefits to it. The first, is the concept that you should not make decisions with your mind. I have to admit, this shocked me fully awake. I have been a seeker for a long time of all types of spiritual modalities, however, what HD provided was a much truer way to be awake. In seeing how we allow our mind to make up reality or go far into the future or stay stuck in the past, liberation from that (by seeing) has been by far the biggest benefit of HD. I precisely recall when I felt slapped awake - about 3 months into the experiment - listening to a friend yammer on about this and that - it was all mind "what if's". It was actually incredible to witness...because what I saw in her, I could also see in myself. We do it all the time. That's why meditation or other techniques to get "out of your mind" are always being explored. That alone has caused me to be more present, more relaxed and more joyful. Plus the knowledge also backed up things I innately felt and experienced all my life...that there is some sort of invisible energy or information stream that threads us together. That relates us. I've had far too many of these experiences to doubt it anymore. (I believe this to be the neutrino stream Ra spoke of and which is scientifically proven.) Other aspects that make sense are the different human types - again, something I could never put my finger on prior to knowing HD, but was felt and experienced. Being a non energy type, I have gotten tons of kick back in my life - and always never understood how I could make a clear observation, state it, be ignored only to have it repeated soon afterward by another being and it be accepted if not applauded. That has maddened me most of my life. Now I see what is happening. Same is true with the body centers info - most of it seems verifiable. Now, there are some things I'm not sure about...lingering own hypothesis, etc. I'm not ready to share them yet, because I am still experimenting. However, overall, HD has helped me to SEE and transform my own life. It is one person at a time, as I simply can't stand to be involved with it in groups. Even in Toronto for a Projector's meeting with Ra, I didn't like being in the group and all that goes with it. I have some distinct individuality that really resists groups. I am doing this for me mostly on my own. Sharing it only when it feels right.

    So, I can verify the benefits of being able to gain perspective and have a greater understanding that we are mostly likely not all the same. And in that, be more understanding of my self and others. This is precious as it allows you to not judge or demand others to be like you. We are all unique. Thankfully. In that, I find comfort and some sort of sense that we are all here to develop as we should for wherever we are in our journey as a soul. And that I believe is not equal or the same - and therefore, should not be measured, ever.

    1. Problem is that along with a teaching from an individual spiritual teacher, there is also an energetic transmission that comes along with it. The more one aligns oneself with the mind and heart and soul of a teacher, the more open we become to influences both positive and negative. I am thinking of a story of someone I know who got a healing from someone and was healed but also received some of her addictions/unsalutary appetities, which took him 3 months to clean out. This is one reason why it may be protective to stay within established traditions with deep roots, because within each old system there are antibodies to bad elements, or the tradition would not have been able to survive for hundreds or thousands of years. One example is sufism. Many people though are (understandibly) wary of the trouble that comes along with tradition. One has to struggle inside such things to make them work, but on the other hand experimentation comes with risks. No way away from risks, but... I also feel like religious traditions have mansions of light--cities--quite well established, built in the Unseen, while if someone tries to begin their own thing, it may be more like a dirt track than a 4 lane freeway/autobahn.

  2. Question: how can you know exact time for pre-natal calculation (Design, in red color) ?? Some of us born relatively prematurely, others - cesarean section, etc. I don't think it is anyhow possible to find out exact time of pre-natal, or our unconscious definition formation. Any opinions?

    1. It is ALWAYS 88 days before birth, not due date according to HD system.
      I am studying it these days and it has been INCREDIBLY accurate about every one I have tested. I don't know why it is working and I just don't care any more. There is nothing less scientific than speculating every thing from a skeptics point of view. The best scientists have always been forward thinking otherwise the earth would be flat and they would have a million reasons to justify it.
      I haven't spent a dime on this and I have no gurus so if it is a cult they are doing one hell of a shitty job :)

  3. i'm with benjamin here. i don't understand how it works, but its accuracy and consistency are striking. (ra's explanation for how it works is as good as any i've heard, tho:

    i've looked at at least 100 charts of people i know well and... it's pretty astounding. it has taken a couple years of fairly serious study to master the basic concepts of this system well enough to "grok" an analysis on the fly. i've spent nothing. the available resources for free online are vast. scribd has the incarnation cross transcripts and rave iching available for free. has an enormous archive available for free. so does jovian. i understand ra can come off as an authoritarian creepo... he freaked me out at first and i stayed away from the HDS for years after my first free introductory reading in india. but if you look at ra's design he makes a lot more sense (5/1 ego- manifestor 10 1st lines, cross of the clarion, open root and solar plex). he clearly had his own baggage. but he never claimed to be more than a messenger...

  4. .....well, i can admit that there are some dogmatic elements in the teachings of the human design system, but my occupation with it since nearly 15 years shows me that there is a stunnig relevance of the characterics of the rave for the life of these persons, also the composit (relationship) raves show an absolutely fitting system.....

  5. ...but anyhow, are there people in bangkok right now who want to have an exchange about this subject? please leave a note here, thanks......

  6. You are told to experiment for yourself. If it's not for you. Who are you to tell anyone what is correct for them?

  7. This comment has been removed by the author.

  8. I just learned about Human Design exactly a week ago. I was given a little info based on my birth date. I was thinking, Oh lord, astrology. But what I was told about myself was so amazing, I said to my host "You have just explained my entire life to me in less than 15 minutes!"

    I wish I could say my skeptical/analytical side was working overtime.... but rather, I was floored. Since I've only had this one amazing experience and have not decided whether or not to pursue more interaction with HD, I cannot tell you what I truly think. Part of me says "Scientology, voodoo-science, astrology - not real." Another side says, "Now I understand what has been happening my whole life!"

    I am confused, and excited. I want to know more, but am afraid to get further involved. I don't see how it could be a money-making scam, but it could mess with me emotionally.

    I just wanted to put this out there.

    1. Hi - I had the same reaction - confusion, doubt and excitement. Since experimenting with HD I have gotten to know the deep peace I have always been searching for. Ra's talks come from a place of real self and not distorted by any mind BS - probably why he doesn't respond to questions about it. He was here to pass on as much information to as many people who wished to experiment for themselves. Doubt is part of my HD design so I take it all in and then go out into the world to see for myself. Even the person I am working with tells me not to believe a word he says - that we are each unique and each will find our own way in this. Or not.

  9. I'd like to see more discussion on this subject from the argument that HD is dangerous.
    I've been aware of HD for 5 years now, simply being aware of my Type and the Types of those around me. This has been incredibly helpful to understanding myself and others, as well as my failed marriage. I now consider myself a Renegade Analyst - learning the system with the resources I can find and determined to spend little or nothing along the way. This decision was precipitated by a chain of synchronicity that guided me back to the system, so I have zero doubt that the guiding principal in my life sees value in it. The dangers I do see in the system can be solved by circumventing the the mother organisation and freeing the information into the public domain. If it was truly inspired by the higher force as Ra said, then it should be as free as Astrology, Tarot, Numerology etc etc

  10. I've just recently come across HD and having been a student of divinatory systems for many years, immediately put it through some filters to see what was there. My analysis: the core concepts, i.e. the synthesis of astrology, i ching, kabbalah, and chakrahs is pretty brilliant. It is also built on hundreds of years of work by thousands and thousands of people. The "prophecy" aspect is fascinating but largely irrelevant at this point. In addition, all the use of physics terms are questionable at best. The aspects of HD that I find the most disappointing is both the integration of a "guru" (which seems to directly contradict what HD claims is the direction humanity is moving towards, i.e. personal authority); the pyramid scheme/commercial dynamic is just silly, full of the same tired new age tropes "FIND YOUR TRUE SELF!" "GET ABUNDANCE WITH YOUR REAL DNA SELF" etc.; lastly i find most of the created language, including the types and profile descriptions to be very silly rehashes.
    That being said, the unadulterated information is pretty spectacular.